There's been a surprising amount of upstream change in these two projects, so I think we are due new stable releases of both. The last stable releases were on Feb 24th, about 4.5 months ago. Is there anything you're waiting to get in? Rich. -- Richard Jones, Virtualization Group, Red Hat http://people.redhat.com/~rjones Read my programming and virtualization blog: http://rwmj.wordpress.com virt-builder quickly builds VMs from scratch http://libguestfs.org/virt-builder.1.html